Updated list of bad poll firms to those that do not know. (7)

Rachel and or Ed and Lawrence should do a show on this?

187 are strongly Dem, 50 are likely Dem, and 53 are barely Dem. That does not seem all that strong to me. Am I wrong?

Not that it matters much, but Tennessee is definitely red, red, red.

strongly Dem from 187 to 189, the likely Dem from 50 to 38, and the barely Dem for 53 to 63. The total stays the same.

....but I guess not.

Tax cheat - well documented.

Mitt Romney's Tax Dodge

Liar - Bain bought viable companies, squeezed every last cent out of the balance sheets for investor profit and in the process destroyed the company and many jobs along with it. The lying bastard was never a "job creator" and the corporate class is not a job creator. They exist to make profit. Right now they are sitting on billions if not trillions of dollars of cash handed to them through the bush tax cuts. Money that could be doing a lot to employ people and rebuild the country and economy.

The First Debate: Mitt Romney's Five Biggest Lies

Fraud - see tax cheat and liar above. If he is the great businessman that he claims to be, why can't we see the tax returns? Are they that fucking bad? What criminal activity will they expose? How is an election against a lying asshole like this even close?

Right down to its roots the GOP offering is fraud, theft and false propaganda. While it might seem a throwaway just to maintain a fake smokescreen over undeserved Congressional and statehouse power it certainly is a total attempt to win anyway and any way they can. it is a test of impunity standards every year while Dems remain stationary in honest registration and moderation mode. What the Dems fail to do to protect the vote the GOP dares to take up and reverse on their heads alone.

The ticket represents the heart and core of the GOP whether their voters like it or not. This will end up being groundwork for next time depending exactly on how dependably little the Dems react to this steady encroachment against their vote totals and fair public forums.

It's quite a list, with names and organization trees and specified donors replete with naked agendas that no American in their right mind is quite exposed to by a heavily fraudulent or useless news community.

Registration: Limit all Dem and local efforts to register general voters but allow GOP fraud efforts and their targeted registration of their people. They grouse about early voting, trying to get their losing numbers in but count on big efforts to kill that if they "rebound" in still rigged states.

Removing people from roles. Individual battles and general war will continue with no question it seems of anyone able to lay down a general law or enforcement of the issue. Numerous, dirty and well known methods.

Trench warfare on Obama SCOTUS nominees. If no other obstruction happens, this will to the bitter end. This simply is their golden ticket at the end of the dark rainbow.

The electoral college. Roles have shifted. It is now the GOP, not just complacent but desperate to game the one way you can win with less popular votes- which is very likely since they will not ever benefit the people(47,50,60,80%). You would think with the simple Dem majorities in cities and big states this would be risky, but it is doable, necessary and gamed by "red" state giveaways which is the flip side of the once consistently limited Dem electoral strategy.

Electronic voting machines. For a system of INHERENTLY, by its very nature, insecure electronic translation of ballot choice and counting every stage where an electronic transfer occurs is "hackable". Nothing, nada, has been been to halt or reverse the increase and dominance of this adulterated crap. Every part of the process works for the GOP, from breakdowns(long lines, shrinking number of polling places, ballot switching, bad numbers) to outright total manipulation with man in the middle editing, even out of state is entrusted to GOP leaning companies with proprietary software that rarely follow the weak guidelines and checks where they are in place. The vine of party leadership does not feed reform (or anti-false reform)efforts.

The general corruption of politics by money. The general lack of law and order in elections except for irrational GOP bullying.

Finally, when collared the old political shrug. "We just have to swamp the swamp with more Dem votes, lean more to the general propaganda enforced delusions, live with corruption, face up to the people never being able to match big money(most of which is ending up as our tax and savings funneled into the noose that hangs us)." No vision for reform anymore, nearly as muted as blacked out media news.

By the way, it seems the stories spill out without digging about them using every dirty election trick that ever existed to get the impossible tyranny over the under-served majority. The fact is, pols don't want election laws applied to them as a matter of greatest self-interest. There public treason flourishes as in few other public areas of law.

With a principle of no accountability honest voting is merely the last remaining threat to their careers.

- a very clever way to skew the polls and perhaps steal another election.

It would be a very good idea to list these pollsters, and perhaps out them.

I'll start with 2 that have been outed here on DU:

Gravis
ARG - American Research Group.

Are these 2 included in the right-wing shifting of the "weighted polls"?

so far its
Rasmussen
Gravis
ARG- American Research Group
Crossroads GPS
American Crossroads

such a biased poll.

Basically, they call more Republicans than Dems because they only take the first call answered and older voters, who trend Repub, are home more during the day and early eve than younger Dems. They never re-dial the same number twice, so they take the first who answers their call, trending older voters.

Its all explained here on this page:

http://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2012/Info/rasmussen.html

My dad worked for the Corps of Engineers at the highest civilian level. He had to deal with politics often.

One thorn in his side was the salmon runs on the Columbia River and the impact that Dams had on them.

Often this issue would pit biologists against each other in court.

My dad often said, "A biologist will reflect the science of the people that write his paycheck".

You can say the same thing about pollsters.

and... GOTV!

....I guess the question now is which polls have not been corrupted by Rove's efforts and are still producing honest results? Those are the polls we should be watching, if any.

I wish we had access to the internal polls being conducted by the Obama Campaign.

Fear is what the right has been selling for years--not just selling, but giving away. Frightened people are easily swayed by empty promises spoken with conviction and the right are filled with confidence (confidence men usually are--otherwise, they couldn't con anyone!)

The Columbus Dispatch here in Ohio is working to write the story of this race as the tale of Mitt coming from behind and winning with his "proven leadership" BS. They were wrong four years ago; I think they are still wrong. I'm sure the other corporate media are following the same line. But not all things being sold are bought.

closer than it is so that, (a) more of their side will feel compelled to donate; (b) the media will ramp up "it's anybody's ballgame" story; and (c) when the RepubliKKKans steal the 2 - 4% they are capable of doing, less suspicion will be thrown their way.
Right?

be rewarded both by MSM and by Rove & Co. I get so tired of this shite sometimes! However, I NEVER give up, EVER!

to do away with all polls. this roller coaster ride is too stressful. just GOTV and it'll be four more years.

McCain was close up to election day and Obama ended up winning. I would trust the Obama campaign's internal polls and get out and volunteer! We won't win unless we GOTV.

"Truthers", well they were setting up for their own polls to bombard showing their candidate favors. Always remember when they scream about something they are doing it themselves. Voter fraud, guess who is doing the actually the voter fraud, yes the GOP.

Yes, the GOPpers are setting up for a potential steal and I have no doubt about it. Yes the GAWD fearing so called "Christians" (NOT) are evil hell and if there is a heaven and hell I truly hope they meet him, the devil with open arms!

Look at Libya, the house goppers are covering up and putting blame on O. These are some truly evil people who follow satan not GOD.

Obama will win

I've received three telephone calls this week doing political polls. I've hung up on all three.

One of the callers ask me to participate in a short survey. Nearly ten minutes later, after being asked some very leading questions, I ended the call. The caller, then called back three times, to try to get me to finish the poll. I might add that this was 9:30 at night.

Last night I received a robo poll call asking me to respond using the telephone keypad. I picked random keys to answer all questions.

I'm tired of the daily interuptions of telephone politics...

I like to tell them I am an independent. I make it clear who I will vote for and these same companies keep calling back. In some ways I am an independent anyway - like a Bernie Sander's progressive rather than a corporate Democrat.

Peace and remember skew their polls.

Cheers
Sandy

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251133102

Sometimes they block their phone # so you will see "private caller" on your caller ID. Sometimes they use a fake name like "Alexandria VA" when they are actually calling from another location. And if you ask, they refuse to identify themselves as anything other than a "national polling firm."

Obviously, many Obama voters will see through this and not participate, so the #s they get will be way off.

I'm surprised they are going to all this trouble to commit fraud, when they could simply lie about calling anyone.

or number, I don't answer and simply let the machine pick up. Many of the callers (and pollsters, too, I guess) have gotten wise to this and block their outgoing number, so many, many calls say "Unknown caller". If it says that, I do not ever pick up. If it's someone I actually know and they start talking to leave a message, I can pick up the phone and talk to them.

Ironically, this morning I got a call and it was announced as "Unknown caller." So I let the machine pick up. A few seconds into the call I hear a voice say, "Hello, this is John McCain....calling for Mitt Romney...." I jumped up at that point, picked up the receiver and then hung back up, thus ending the call. I hope they recorded that as a hang up! LOL That is the second or third call like that we've received in the past week. One was from Ann Romney. Ick....

Sure wish they'd leave this life long Democrat alone. But at least my machine helps screen my calls!

All these polls posts were making me nervous and suspicious of many of the posters.

This is a logical inconsistency.

that is why

the house is now have a chance but I don't want it to go had a chance

every seat is important, every state, optismism breeds optimism
negativity dissent is what they want

With the house we control the investigations
With an amount of GOOD democrats closer to 60, we can stop obstruction as the middle roaders of the right will have to do something or get a challenger

we are very close, on the cusp of forever holding power

the more in the house and senate, the better the SCOTUS pick going from acceptable to legendary great

That is why

and these polls bring the demoralization of the "troops" here and in real life

every vote counts

agitated is a word security in hospitals uses to chain an elderly person to the bed
or cops use right before tasering a person 50 times
what exactly is this word agitated used for here?

And even Nate Silver, today has obama at around 65% chance of winning.
Mitt is up to 35% but hey there ho there, I would think 2 to 1 is great odds and anyhow, one can't legally bet in the US on elections

but if people write a headline"Mitt and Glove are up to 35" it is a negative headline and is a loser and the politics of demoralization
Whereas if the headline is Obama leads Mitt in odds to win 2 to 1, well baby that sounds like a winner to me.

which would you rather a person entering a thread read?
in the words of a poster who once was on another board I had the mispleasure of bumping into "methinks" I would rather have a 2 to 1 odds of winning.(and that is right at this moment from Nate Silver.)

and I want to win the house, then we can investigate Isaa and wonder why he is wasting so much money going on fishing trips when he should be working for America.

And it would be just like Rove to do that.

They are gleeful at how easily we are manipulated. They are gleeful at how they manipulate right wingers, there is no doubt, but they need more sophisticated methods for manipulating us, and if it works, are even more thrilled at their "accomplishment."

the theft easier.

Just as soon as the election is over and surprise, surprise....they can claim, Well, it was a very close, tight race. Our man just got more voters to the polls. Or something similar. They will try to soothe us with that explanation and will discount exit polls and any other method they can find to not make a fuss over the results. They will say Obama fought a good fight but the voters chose Romney. They are counting us griping, complaining bitterly, posting our sadness and outrage here and other places. And then doing nothing but lick our wounds and go quietly away. How long are we going to keep doing this?

I am not sure how you fight against this if no one will listen to you or discounts your arguments. They will tell us and everyone else that we are simply wearing Tin Foil Hats and are just not rational or we are just showing our sour grapes over the outcome. I wish I knew that we would really take the streets with pitch forks and torches. But alas, I fear that if it is stolen (AGAIN), we will just bitch and moan among ourselves until we're all worn out and defeated.

Any signs of hope that we're not going to do this any more? Will it be possible to use the organization that the Obama Team has built to take our outrage and distrust to the next level? Or is Resistance futile?

I really am apprehensive. If it is stolen, I so hope for massive resistance! The days of licking our wounds in a quiet corner are gone

It was unbelievable! Like magic, this large bounty of polls was dumped on us--and most of these polls were from organizations that we'd never heard of. And all of these polls favored Romney.

And you know what? If they have to lie about poll numbers and pull a stunt like that--for sure they are losing.

demoralization can cause a "theft" without the actual need for a theft.

demoralization as a political tool leads to depressing the vote, people think a theft will happen, the figure why bother
people get depressed and voila, without actually having a theft occur, the result is the same, our candidate loses.

It is another reason that people here, need to take a positive attitude back to their friends and family and pass it along to them that Obama will win. And implore them to also carry it forward to their friends and their friends and workers families.and so on and so on

I have not seen one Obama voter shift sides to Mitt. NOT ONE.
And the phony polls are why it seems like it has occurred, but it is just an illusion

and it goes on


It is why they keep going, because they know this, they created this and they want to demoralize us so they keep winning.

We can beat Karl Rove and the republicans by winning this election and the ones in 2014 and 2016 and 2018 and 2020 and 2022.
We can win the house, we can win the senate, the presidency and we need to win the governorships in Texas and Florida especially and then with their side out of office and not controlling the agenda and election bureaus, they lose

We must get all democratic voters to ignore the media in total, and just think of getting their vote in, early, absentee, or at the polls 11/6/2012, and the prize is winning reelection and taking the senate and taking back the house.
ONly vote for democrats or those that will caucus with the democrats (like Angus King) in states where at all cost, we must defeat the republicanlibertarianteaparty(any and all, they are one and the same, as they are a vote against President Obama.) NO WASTED VOTES, no sitting home. NO excuses.
No retreat, no surrender.

The more democrats and those that side with the democrats, the more Karl Rove and the boys are defeated. 2010 proved what happens when democrats do not vote.Democrats stayed home, and they spinned it that it was against Obama's agenda. NO it was not. By not voting, we lost and it directly elected those draconian governors in Fl/Wisc/NJ,etc.

Hi. I am new to Democratic Underground. I saw your discussion of polls like ARG, Gravis, and We Ask America. I wonder where I can find more info on how they are Republican leaning or connected in some way to Karl Rove. Thanks for any help...