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Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:51 PM

I challenge you to name the defining moment of the debate.

There was none.

Yes, the debate was disappointing. The President seemed off his game. By contrast, Romney seemed prepared and enthused. But let's be clear: Romney did not land any punches. There were no great debate moments. This is not one for the history books.

We'll see how it plays out over the next few days. For now, my message to you is this:



By the way, sorry about the crappy performance of our website. We were expecting huge traffic, but we got slammed even worse than we expected. Possibly worse than ever. We're already digging around in the server trying to figure out what we can do to (hopefully) do better next time. Thanks for your understanding.

Skinner
DU Admin

156 replies, 17112 views

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Reply I challenge you to name the defining moment of the debate. (Original post)
Skinner Oct 2012 OP
Arctic Dave Oct 2012 #1
white_wolf Oct 2012 #16
Arctic Dave Oct 2012 #23
msanthrope Oct 2012 #43
andym Oct 2012 #132
The Magistrate Oct 2012 #2
bemildred Oct 2012 #125
BellaKos Oct 2012 #3
femrap Oct 2012 #137
NYC_SKP Oct 2012 #4
Lex Oct 2012 #14
SaveAmerica Oct 2012 #85
Horse with no Name Oct 2012 #5
Liberal_Stalwart71 Oct 2012 #75
demgrrrll Oct 2012 #111
leveymg Oct 2012 #6
WI_DEM Oct 2012 #7
XemaSab Oct 2012 #8
Horse with no Name Oct 2012 #18
Bonobo Oct 2012 #9
busterbrown Oct 2012 #107
Cha Oct 2012 #10
Dash87 Oct 2012 #11
MADem Oct 2012 #12
seabeyond Oct 2012 #29
Grammy23 Oct 2012 #138
seabeyond Oct 2012 #139
otohara Oct 2012 #35
Plaid Adder Oct 2012 #80
Coyotl Oct 2012 #154
Politicub Oct 2012 #13
ornotna Oct 2012 #15
Texas Lawyer Oct 2012 #17
flamingdem Oct 2012 #34
spanone Oct 2012 #19
aint_no_life_nowhere Oct 2012 #20
trailmonkee Oct 2012 #21
flamingdem Oct 2012 #37
rainbow4321 Oct 2012 #92
demwing Oct 2012 #73
Liberal_Stalwart71 Oct 2012 #77
uponit7771 Oct 2012 #22
Baitball Blogger Oct 2012 #24
seabeyond Oct 2012 #25
Whisp Oct 2012 #26
Starry Messenger Oct 2012 #27
tinrobot Oct 2012 #42
lonestarnot Oct 2012 #51
anneboleyn Oct 2012 #57
burrowowl Oct 2012 #106
Moostache Oct 2012 #62
countryjake Oct 2012 #63
Starry Messenger Oct 2012 #64
countryjake Oct 2012 #71
lonestarnot Oct 2012 #76
Starry Messenger Oct 2012 #81
Ed Suspicious Oct 2012 #94
Generic Other Oct 2012 #108
countryjake Oct 2012 #115
Hutzpa Oct 2012 #104
Cali_Democrat Oct 2012 #110
Odin2005 Oct 2012 #128
Liberalynn Oct 2012 #143
Evergreen Emerald Oct 2012 #28
xchrom Oct 2012 #30
mzmolly Oct 2012 #31
Horse with no Name Oct 2012 #49
mzmolly Oct 2012 #83
uponit7771 Oct 2012 #84
mzmolly Oct 2012 #87
adigal Oct 2012 #127
MrsBrady Oct 2012 #148
mzmolly Oct 2012 #149
Liberal_Stalwart71 Oct 2012 #32
Indpndnt Oct 2012 #70
bitchkitty Oct 2012 #33
Nye Bevan Oct 2012 #36
aletier_v Oct 2012 #38
msanthrope Oct 2012 #39
gulliver Oct 2012 #40
Connie_Corleone Oct 2012 #41
anneboleyn Oct 2012 #59
lolamio Oct 2012 #120
Coyotl Oct 2012 #155
lonestarnot Oct 2012 #44
countryjake Oct 2012 #45
devilgrrl Oct 2012 #46
hay rick Oct 2012 #47
Brigid Oct 2012 #48
backscatter712 Oct 2012 #50
cal04 Oct 2012 #52
Wednesdays Oct 2012 #53
Maeve Oct 2012 #140
Flatpicker Oct 2012 #54
Indpndnt Oct 2012 #55
RoccoR5955 Oct 2012 #56
Norrin Radd Oct 2012 #58
Major Hogwash Oct 2012 #60
Daemonaquila Oct 2012 #61
AverageJoe90 Oct 2012 #65
ohheckyeah Oct 2012 #66
ellisonz Oct 2012 #105
ohheckyeah Oct 2012 #129
krawhitham Oct 2012 #67
Shampoobra Oct 2012 #68
ailsagirl Oct 2012 #72
Indpndnt Oct 2012 #74
lonestarnot Oct 2012 #79
ailsagirl Oct 2012 #69
Sparkly Oct 2012 #78
lonestarnot Oct 2012 #82
SoapBox Oct 2012 #89
SaveAmerica Oct 2012 #86
RichGirl Oct 2012 #88
craigmatic Oct 2012 #90
Amonester Oct 2012 #95
ms liberty Oct 2012 #134
yellowdogmi Oct 2012 #91
Scootaloo Oct 2012 #93
Mellow56 Oct 2012 #96
hopeisaplace Oct 2012 #97
Cha Oct 2012 #113
Douglas Carpenter Oct 2012 #98
garthranzz Oct 2012 #99
Live and Learn Oct 2012 #100
ellisonz Oct 2012 #101
LittleBlue Oct 2012 #102
demgrrrll Oct 2012 #112
mstinamotorcity2 Oct 2012 #103
William769 Oct 2012 #109
FrenchieCat Oct 2012 #114
Spitfire of ATJ Oct 2012 #116
BarackTheVote Oct 2012 #117
tblue37 Oct 2012 #118
genxlib Oct 2012 #119
D23MIURG23 Oct 2012 #121
Not Sure Oct 2012 #122
gollygee Oct 2012 #123
bullwinkle428 Oct 2012 #124
Evasporque Oct 2012 #126
OldDem2012 Oct 2012 #130
JCMach1 Oct 2012 #131
andym Oct 2012 #133
nichomachus Oct 2012 #135
Glitterati Oct 2012 #136
Rowdyboy Oct 2012 #141
Liberalynn Oct 2012 #142
donheld Oct 2012 #144
stevenleser Oct 2012 #145
ibegurpard Oct 2012 #146
SaveAmerica Oct 2012 #147
99Forever Oct 2012 #150
porphyrian Oct 2012 #151
MadDash Oct 2012 #152
southernyankeebelle Oct 2012 #153
Agnosticsherbet Oct 2012 #156

Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:52 PM

1. Did Romney call Obama, Bro?

 

If so, wtf.

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Response to Arctic Dave (Reply #1)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:58 PM

16. I didn't hear that, but...

it sounds like something Romney would do in an attempt to come across as cool and normal. Sadly, he's neither and doesn't hide it very well.

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Response to white_wolf (Reply #16)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:00 AM

23. True.

 

I was thinking he was also trying provoke Obama by being disrespectful.

It was the only clip I watched so I don't know it took place.

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Response to Arctic Dave (Reply #23)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:06 AM

43. He wanted Angry Black Man. And he tried to bait him.

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Response to white_wolf (Reply #16)


Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:52 PM

2. I Agree, Sir: A Draw

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Response to The Magistrate (Reply #2)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 10:47 AM

125. Just the opening, Sir, moving a few pieces out and seeing what your opponent has in mind.

Evaluating his predilections, etc. Setting up your defenses.

President O did exactly what I would have done. If he is wrong, then I would be too.

I rather doubt that Rmoney will learn the right lesson from last night.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:53 PM

3. Well, I, for one, was stunned

when Romney denied that he had ever promised a 5 trillion dollar tax cut in the first few minutes.
I mean, what are we dealing with here? Con man? Serial liar? Delusional?

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Response to BellaKos (Reply #3)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 05:00 PM

137. Word has it

 

Mi$$ has emotional problems (as his wife mentioned)....he was dealing with his manic side last night.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:54 PM

4. Exactly. Nobody lost this one in the moment.

But Romney now has a series of statements he'll have to back up.

In this respect, Obama wins on strategy in the long run.

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #4)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:58 PM

14. I think part of the Obama strategy was let Romney lie unfettered.

And then hold those lies up to his (Romney's) base. He is well known to say anything that sounds good at the time.

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Response to Lex (Reply #14)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:25 AM

85. I agree, I kept saying 'let him hang himself' and Obama kept listening to me

We're tight like that

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:55 PM

5. I accept the challenge

Ezra Klein made a wonderful point.

Romney frustrated Obama by claiming to do things that he can't legislatively do--how do you fight that? You really just can't point to him and say "Liar Liar Pants on Fire"?

I would say that defined the debate--how can debate against impossibilities without sounding truly juvenile by pointing out every lie as that?

Honestly, I think Romney shot his wad during this debate. He showed all of his cards--next time, I think he is going to have to defend the cards he laid out.

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Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #5)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:43 AM

111. Right. It would have devolved into a did not......did too..... are not.....are too so in that

perspective the President did as well as anyone could have under those circumstances.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:55 PM

6. I doubt there are many undecideds out there, and this changed no one's mind.

Someone called it aggressive car salesman versus wonk, and that's probably a pretty accurate characterization of who the two really are. Which would you rather have for President?

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:56 PM

7. I agree, this was supposed to be about the economy basically and really I think Mitt played defense

a lot more than he did in attacking the president. I do think Obama was, as you say, off his game, but he wasn't incompetent and he made no mistakes and he was presidential. In the end I don't think it will change much.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:56 PM

8. Romney calling the president a liar

and Obama standing there like "duh, whut?"

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Response to XemaSab (Reply #8)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:59 PM

18. Well there is one truth whether Romney likes it or not...

Romney IS one of Obama's constituents and he received deferential treatment for that.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:57 PM

9. You're right. No one won.

It was a fight for the middle, both sides trying to claim the center. Romney lied to get there, Obama IS the center so no ground was really lost or taken.

Defining moment for me was Jim Lehrer rolling his eyes in frustration as Romney talked over him.

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Response to Bonobo (Reply #9)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:20 AM

107. If you were watching tonight and understand that Obama saved the auto industry......

then you thought Obama won. If you have no idea that he saved the auto industry then you
probably thought Romney won.
My point..... probably very few switchers tonight.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:57 PM

10. I appreciate the

Advice!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:57 PM

11. Obama was mediocre, but Romney was too.

The debate as a whole was terrible. People are just praising Romney because he was expected to do poorly, while Obama was expected to perform better than he did.

I thought their performances were roughly equal. While it's not fair, in this instance, the advantage goes to Romney because everybody expected him to do poorly.

I wouldn't doubt most people got bored and turned the debate off, though. It was pretty boring and too off-topic to be meaningful.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:58 PM

12. When Romney said he was gonna kill off Big Bird. That defined it for me.

I think he should hire Cheney to do it--he's too chickenshit to do it himself!! Big Bird is larger than a "varmint," too.

It showed me that rMoney is a petty little shit who runs around line iteming little stuff, and he can't "do the math" when it comes to trillions. Babble, babble, babble, and all I took away was he can't add and he hates PBS.

I want to see a cartoon with a dead Big Bird on the rMoney dinner table. That sums up the evening for me!

The guy just is shitty to animals, isn't he? Horses, dogs, and now Big Bird!

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Response to MADem (Reply #12)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:02 AM

29. hubby was watching, i was picking up a kid. a good hour in i asked, how is it going. hubby said...

he is going to kill off big bird.

for real.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #29)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 05:24 PM

138. Thank you for the much needed laugh.

Last night and today have been an up and down experience. I refused to watch a single moment of the TV coverage after I watched some of MSNBC's post debate commentary last night. I was a little down after the debate, but after listening to Tweety and Big Ed go after the President, I was actually despondent. I made up my mind before I went to bed that I would not watch any of the morning shows.....on CNN or Morning Joe. None of it. And I didn't.

I finally got up the nerve to watch about 2 p.m. when The Cycle came on. I knew it was going to be a mixed bag and it was. Thankfully, Krystal Ball had a summation that basically said we Dems just need to calm down and let it go. All will be OK.

So this afternoon I came back to DU to see how things are in cyberspace and found the usual mix of highs and lows.....but more rational this afternoon and less hyper. I think the hysteria has begun to subside just a little.

Then I came to your comment about Killing off Big Bird and that helped put it all in perspective. Thanks for a moment of clarity and a much needed laugh.

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Response to Grammy23 (Reply #138)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 08:08 PM

139. hey... i hear you.

i see it differently than a lot of people with hair on fire. i am not bothered at all what happened in the debate. i really believe ultimately this hurts romney.

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Response to MADem (Reply #12)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:04 AM

35. It Was An Odd Moment, From A Very Odd Man

It was opposite night... My head was spinning.

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Response to MADem (Reply #12)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:44 AM

80. Yeah, actually, I think that's the only real contender. Romney promises to kill Big Bird.

n/t

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Response to MADem (Reply #12)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 03:05 PM

154. Killing Big Bird in front of a national and global audience, worse than Palin at the turkey farm

and the killer so bold as to wear a red tie

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:58 PM

13. I just saw on-the-record lies by Romney

That's about it. And it will be the news tomorrow.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:58 PM

15. For me, it was when he said this



No problems here, I noticed a slight slow down for just a little while.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Wed Oct 3, 2012, 11:58 PM

17. “For 18 months, he's been running on this tax plan, and now five weeks before the election, he's

saying that his big bold idea is 'nevermind.'"

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Response to Texas Lawyer (Reply #17)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:03 AM

34. +1 that was spontaneous and a GOOD ATTACK!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:00 AM

19. k&r...

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:00 AM

20. Here's what I take away from it

"Well, for 18 months he's been running on this tax plan. And now, five weeks before the election, he's saying that his big, bold idea is "never mind."

Romney is Gilda Radner. After going around and around he ends up saying "never mind" as his plan. That's the zinger I came away with.


http://www.npr.org/2012/10/03/162258551/transcript-first-obama-romney-presidential-debate

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:00 AM

21. did you see the reel of interuptions from Romney? the one that Maddow showed?

The interruptions were the defining moment.... Since there were no hard punches and no new substance... Then it could only be character, and on that Obama will get some benefit, especially with woman and seniors

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Response to trailmonkee (Reply #21)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:04 AM

37. The female group I was with disliked that behavior

so I agree with your assessment

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Response to flamingdem (Reply #37)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:52 AM

92. As did the undecided female voters shown by the CNN graph

As soon as mittens interrupted POTUS, the yellow line representing the females flat lined.

Not that any of the M$M or CNN will point that out--why use the damn graph if CNN is not going to actually analyze it afterwards??? Dumb asses.

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Response to trailmonkee (Reply #21)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:36 AM

73. will Romney's interruptions

be like Al Gore's sighes?

People who watched that debate thought Gore won, but the aftermath (read: media spin) was very damaging to Gore. Will the media let Romney off?

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:00 AM

22. ***NOT A GAME CHANGER*** rMoney needed one, he failed regardless

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:00 AM

24. Thank you Skinner.

You're the best.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:01 AM

25. not able to get on latest threads on du???? defined my debate experience for a bit.

i tease.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:01 AM

26. if the game is lieing, yes I agree Obama wasn't onto that game.

Obama was Obama, why anyone thought he would have a total character change for this debate is beyond me.

He will prevail, as always, in his way.
and Big Ed and Co. will jump on the convenient wagon again, when it's convenient for them.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:01 AM

27. Big Bird.

He's an overnight Twitter star!

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #27)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:06 AM

42. Yup. Big Bird.

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Response to tinrobot (Reply #42)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:10 AM

51. And Mr. President may be coming down with the bird flu. Did anyone take his pulse, temp. or

bloodpressure after the debate?

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Response to tinrobot (Reply #42)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:12 AM

57. It's all Big Bird on Twitter

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Response to tinrobot (Reply #42)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:18 AM

106. Yep! Big Bird!

and the zinger might zap him in the arse!

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #27)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:15 AM

62. If anyone at the Obama campaign is smart, they will torture Williard with Big Bird...

PBS funding is so miniscule, but so indelible to so many people in this country from Sesame Street and Mister Rogers that attacking it is stupid. I know Mittens is throwing red meat to the base to cut PBS, but he seems to have forgotten the REAL target is NPR due to it being the ONLY counterweight to 100% right wing AM and FM radio dominance...

Attacking Big Bird (and by extension, Elmo) is going to boomerang on Romney in a myriad of ways that won't be clear for a few days...

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Response to countryjake (Reply #63)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:19 AM

64. I love that one!

Another fave here:

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #64)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:34 AM

71. And another one...

Big Bird now has his own hash tag on Twitter, ha!

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Response to countryjake (Reply #71)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:42 AM

76. He'll be taking over Oscar's trash can.

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Response to countryjake (Reply #71)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:45 AM

81. Ack--those teeth!

Nightmares tonight!

Seriously though, I think people will remember the insane shit Rmoney was spewing--end PBS? WTF is that supposed to help?

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #81)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:52 AM

94. That was meat for the base. They hate

public funded tele and radio.

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Response to countryjake (Reply #71)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:25 AM

108. My best attempt to capture the highpoints of the debate

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Response to Generic Other (Reply #108)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:49 AM

115. Ya need a head-choppin' hatchet in one of his hands...

for full effect, ha!

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #64)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:15 AM

104. I love this one

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #64)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:27 AM

110. LOL. I love that one.

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #27)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 11:25 AM

128. Bingo!

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #27)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 09:05 PM

143. I didn't watch but you are right Big Bird is getting one heck of a lot of publicity right now

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:02 AM

28. In taking a step back my impression

Is that Romney had an odd temperament. He was obviously flustered and aggressive. To me, as Obama gave his first answer Romney reacted so...un presidential. His mannerisms, his demeanor were...off.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:02 AM

30. Obama's weak opening? Just a thought. Nt

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:02 AM

31. When Romney said one need not worry about voucher care

if over the age of 55-ish. That point seems lost on the pundits. To me, it was stunning.

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Response to mzmolly (Reply #31)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:09 AM

49. My blood ran cold at that

I've been looking forward to Medicare for a very long time.

I just watched someone say that they were going to take it away and leave me to the free market--something I have been fighting for many years now and thought it would be a fight I could finally rest from when I am old.

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Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #49)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:12 AM

83. Exactly

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Response to mzmolly (Reply #31)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:21 AM

84. basically saying to those who've paid in 30 - 40yrs "screw you"

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Response to uponit7771 (Reply #84)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:33 AM

87. That's basically it.

And, the pundits are declaring that a 'winning' position, apparently?

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Response to mzmolly (Reply #31)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 11:08 AM

127. Yup. I am 51, paid taxes since I was 12, but screw me

and my husband.

Nice.

Why isn't this the headlines???

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Response to mzmolly (Reply #31)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 12:56 AM

148. I'm 40 and it sure as hell worried me....

i couldn't believe he said that...

I mean...he tried to side step the issues all night long...
but was stupid enough to say that....
I mean, he was really showing his true colors with that statement.

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Response to MrsBrady (Reply #148)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 02:48 PM

149. Agreed.

Disgusting, elitist, out of touch commentary.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:02 AM

32. Even though I got called "silly" and "dumb," here's my take on the debate...

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Response to Liberal_Stalwart71 (Reply #32)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:34 AM

70. Neither silly nor dumb.

I happen to agree with you.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:03 AM

33. It made me regret my interest in politics -

it was that boring. It was so polite I expected them to pull out cups of tea and start sipping.

But I agree - it won't change much.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:04 AM

36. No apology for the website is needed, at least to me.

I was surfing DU on my iPhone throughout the debate and had no issues at all.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:05 AM

38. "No... let's not"

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:05 AM

39. Romney intended his 'zingers' to be delivered in response to Angry Black Man. When he didn't show

up, Romney wasn't able to deliver the punchlines.


He tried. But he failed.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021464287

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:05 AM

40. "is the reason that [Romney] is keeping all these plans to replace secret because they're too good?"

That was the highlight for me.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:06 AM

41. Big Bird being fired by Romney.

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Response to Connie_Corleone (Reply #41)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:14 AM

59. It's already a meme

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Response to Connie_Corleone (Reply #41)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 08:07 AM

120. I do think that it's going to resonate.

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Response to lolamio (Reply #120)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 03:07 PM

155. Actually, Big Bird ranked highest on Twitter debate comments

It rankled a lot of feathers

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:06 AM

44. Mittwitt = lots of promises, no plans. He lied lied lied and was not called on any of them.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:07 AM

45. I think it was a terrible debate, over all...

as normal debates go, that is. I do not believe that Mitch seemed "prepared", but rather he appeared like someone juiced up on something, eyes wider than a cat ready to pounce, fast-talking like a kid caught in the act, and generally obnoxious, like a spieler selling a shit-product.

Obama is not a "pouncer", so the Rmoney-cacaphony went unchallenged for the most part, which pretty much cancels out any "debate" aspect of the spectacle. If this were a debate-team event, neither would have come out a winner, in my lowly opinion, because the points were never argued successfully.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)


Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:08 AM

47. Obama was giving points and didn't cover.

Them's the rules, thanks to our wonderful media.

The defining moments for me:

Romney admitting he wanted vouchers and moving the age of those affected up to "near 60." This is a huge vulnerability in his campaign and he just made it worse.

Obama twice failing to defend "$90 billion in green energy" spending. Wake up, Barack!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:08 AM

48. No, no real fireworks.

I guess that's what we were hoping for and didn't get.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:09 AM

50. Defining tactic: Romney's Gish Gallop.

Romney took a few snorts of cocaine, walked on the stage and unleashed a firehose of bullshit that's damned difficult to counter without falling into the wonk trap. I think Obama recognized that trying to counter the Gish Gallop in this ridiculous circus of a debate was futile.

Stay tuned for fact-checking, a new torrent of attack ads calling rMoney the lying sack of shit that he is, and an aggressive campaign by Obama and his surrogates in an environment where Obama can take control.

My only advice is that Obama should work a little more at pivoting and reframing so he looks a little better, and doesn't fall into the wonk trap. That said, Obama didn't really fall on his face, and Romney's already being called out on his lies.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:10 AM

52. No defining moment just Romney looking

arrogant and and letting everyone know he doesn't have to go by any rules and Lerher let him get away with it

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:10 AM

53. Agreed

Lest we forget:

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Response to Wednesdays (Reply #53)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 08:19 PM

140. Thanks, I've always loved that one! eom

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:10 AM

54. I think there may be a few

But, you won't see them until later this week.

Mitt talked so fast that he boxed himself in a bit.
Now he has to explain his Medicare, SS, Tax, and replacement for Obamacare policies while he gets hammered by ads using his own words against him.

How does he do that without alienating his base? (he slapped them today) I don't know..

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:11 AM

55. Thank you!

Well said.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:11 AM

56. The end

I was glad it was over. Mitt hanged himself by his own petard. The lies and flip-flops will come out in the next several days.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:13 AM

58. This:

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:14 AM

60. When it was over!!

I win!!!

What do I get for winning this superfluous challenge?

"Tell 'em, Don Pardo!"

"He wins . . . a wet t-shirt once worn by Pamela Anderson!"

*cheers from audience*

Ooooh, it's all stretched out, and it's still wet! Yuck!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:14 AM

61. LOL. Yeah, I'm tired of the thousand panicked threads too.

It's ok, folks. There were problems on both sides. The question is whether Romney's campaign can better capitalize on Obama's tiredness and images of himself looking energetic and fresh (better cut most of the dialogue, though!), or whether Obama's can crucify Mittens for being a lying sack without any substance. 48 hours will tell. Until then, yeah - Keep Calm & Carry On.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:24 AM

65. Skinner, thank you. Thank you very much. nt

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:24 AM

66. The main thing I really didn't

understand was why Obama let Romney get away with the $716 billion (trillion?) out of Medicare comments.

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Response to ohheckyeah (Reply #66)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:16 AM

105. Aloha

It's billion and that's reductions in the projected growth of Medicare over 10 fiscal years.

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Response to ellisonz (Reply #105)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:56 PM

129. I know.....

but didn't Mitt say trillions? That's why I put both. Thanks for the reply!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:29 AM

67. He is going to Fire Big Bird

that was the defining moment

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:31 AM

68. Skinner, Free Republic was down during the debate, and it's still down, 2 hours after it ended

My only problem with DU was its inability to deliver the Greatest Threads page.

FR, on the other hand, totally crashed and is still burning.

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Response to Shampoobra (Reply #68)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:35 AM

72. Good.

But seriously, one "unexpected" debate performance does NOT a president make. So the little repukes need to "calm down" and not take it too seriously.

On the contrary-- I think that snippets will be played over and over during the next while, pointing out the lies and BS that Nitt was spouting.

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Response to Shampoobra (Reply #68)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:38 AM

74. Lol! Their tiny minds exploded when Willard said he cares about everyone.

Minds. Blown.

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Response to Shampoobra (Reply #68)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:43 AM

79. Tee hee!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:32 AM

69. Thanks, Skinner

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:43 AM

78. Du servers getting slammed is GOOD news.

I agree. There were no punches, sound bytes, zingers, gotchas, etc.

I was watching on CNN and couldn't keep my eyes of that distracting ongoing line of approval/disapproval for Colorado undecided men and women. It's like a laugh-track indicator. ("This is funny; this isn't." "This is good; this isn't.")

Even among low-information voters (how could they be be undecided otherwise), Romney didn't score all that big. The discrepancy between men and women was remarkable, too, all the way through.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 12:46 AM

82. Everything is working just fine Skinner and you and DU Admin have created my special haven during

these disappointing times. Thank you all! Defining moment mittwitt laughing about kids sitting on the floor in classrooms.

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Response to lonestarnot (Reply #82)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:35 AM

89. My thoughts exactly.

Thanks Skinner and to EarlG too.

I loves ya for what you folks do for all the DUers.



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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:27 AM

86. Skinner, don't you miss NC and our BBQ? I agree here, I didn't get the need

for the freak-out I was seeing on here. Now that I think about it I imagine that a lot of people got spoiled by Romney being a dolt and Obama being on TOP that when the two met the great equalizer some took it as the end of the world.

Obama HAS GOT THIS!!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:34 AM

88. I think Obama made many exellents points...

One of the best was to point out that they could lower the cost of healthcare buy removing the "profit" aspect. Could anything be more obvious. Yet Romney didn't seem to get it...he went on to say that insurance companies will get you the best deal. How is it that you get a better deal having to pay a middle man...paying two sources instead of just one.

And Romney going on about how great the voucher deal was...you can pick and choose your own insurance company. Obama pointed out that insurance companies can pick and choose who they insure. Thus insuring heathier people and not the sick ones. Again...Romney didn't get it.

Seriously...I'd like to find one person paying for their own health insurance who thinks they are getting a great deal. I'd like to find one senior who isn't thrilled to get medicare and not have to deal with insurance companies anymore.

Seriously...HOW THE HELL DID ROMNEY WIN THIS DEBATE???? Were people not listening????

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:44 AM

90. For me it was when Obama let mittens slide on the 715 billion in cuts to medicaid.

He just repeated himself instead of refuting what mittens said. But that was just 1 debate and we still have 3 more. Obama didn't have to be aggressive and mittens did but this won't change the outcome of the election.

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Response to craigmatic (Reply #90)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:58 AM

95. He didn't.

He clearly stated that these cuts were taken back from over-payments to insurance companies and fraud from providers, and that they now serve to reduce the costs of prescription drugs for seniors, which is the plain old truth BTW.

Granted, the bully repeated it twice, and the second time, he looked like the fool.

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Response to Amonester (Reply #95)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:24 PM

134. Thank you! I thought I was the only one who noticed! n/t

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:51 AM

91. I thought he was playing rope a dope.

While he was not everything I remember from the last campaign he still made his points and I think gathered enough ammunition to finish Romney. He did seem tired but the President has a day job. I have been on Hiatus from here for a very long time just checking in tonight to say hey to all of my old friends and tell everyone to keep the faith.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:52 AM

93. "I LIKE COAL!" And he was just crashing downhill from there.

"My sons are lairs!"
"I'll kill PBS!"
"3% of small businesses employ 25% of all Americans!"
"I'll make jobs by firing people"

And then this...

Obama: "Governor Romney has ruled out revenue."
Lehrer: "Has he-"
Romney: "*interrupting* Absolutely!"


Actually, Romney running all over Jim Lehrer was pretty "defining," too. Jesus Christ. I'm not going to damn Lehrer for it, since you don't really shout down a presidential candidate on camera, even if he's motormouthing and interrupting.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:07 AM

96. The Middle Class buried

by gas prices and cost of food ect. Yeah, I think the Koch brothers are oil men who donate to the Republicans. So when we all go fill up just think our dollars are going by the billions to defeat the Democrats.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:08 AM

97. when Romney used Big Bird in a sentence

it was bizarre

the President was factual and classy, Big Bird's enemy was not.

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Response to hopeisaplace (Reply #97)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:47 AM

113. Now that's a Zinger!


"the President was factual and classy, Big Bird's enemy was not."

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:08 AM

98. yeah, no knock out punches - but it was better night for the Romney than it was for the President

It does not necessarily change the fundamentals of the race which still favor the President. I recall following the first Mondale/Reagan debate of 1984 - Mondale was so on target and Reagan performed so pathetically - the generous comment made by one of Reagan's honest supporters was, "well at least he didn't drool." Obama certainly was not't that bad. In fact he wasn' really bad at all. As James Carville put it, "he acted like he just didn't want to be there." I'm afraid that showed a bit. But basically neither Romney or the President landed any solid punches or scored any great points. When opponents start throwing around technical figures to counter the other sides technical figures - a very muddied picture emerges and nobody really wins the argument.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:10 AM

99. Just a thanks

and a yeah, you're right.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:12 AM

100. I got nothing.

Wish Obama had done better and called Mitt out on his flip flops and outright lies but he didn't make any big errors either.

Mitt's recent 'zinger' practice (as well as his life long experience in lying) served him well tonight but hopefully will be taken apart in the near future.

No defining moment and that gives Obama the win, IMHO.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:12 AM

101. Mitt Romney trying to defend his proposal for voucher-care.

He failed.

President Obama was right - if you're 54 or 55 you better pay attention.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:13 AM

102. "You were fighting for Obamacare, not jobs"

I remember that one.

Romney came at Obama relentlessly about job creation and the president had no answer. He looked like he didn't even want to defend himself. I felt pity for him actually.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #102)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:45 AM

112. He said I was doing both things at the same time, that was his response.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:13 AM

103. Romney

got issues to late to pivot!!!!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:25 AM

109. ...

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 02:49 AM

114. Big Bird is pisssssed.....

Last edited Thu Oct 4, 2012, 03:43 AM - Edit history (1)

and that whole Romney vs. Big Bird may end up being more than any of us would have thought.....

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 03:11 AM

116. This was Romney stealing Obama's ideas....

Suddenly Romney is all about the middle class and improving schools and helping small businesses and he is claiming ALL of the problems in this country STARTED under Obama and that Obama is all about killing jobs.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 03:38 AM

117. Killing PBS

I work for PBS. If Romney is elected and does what he says he'll do, I will lose my job. That was the point where I jumped up off my couch and started flipping off my TV.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 04:29 AM

118. Promising to fire Big Bird was the defining moment of this debate--and it didn't

help Romney.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 08:05 AM

119. Medicare

Big Bird will be the memorable moment but the most important moment for me was about Medicare vouchers.

Romney basically agreed that vouchercare was his plan. But what made it so important was how desparate he was to make sure it was clear that it affected no one over 55. It was the only time he lost a little self control when he was trying to be perfectly clear about that.

This is important because it makes it CRYSTAL clear that the people on Medicare (as well as those soon anticipating it) strongly favor it and would kill any political party that messed with it.

I could see two ads from this;

the first would be clips from the debate with voice over asking why its good enough for seniors but not good enough for you.

The second would be a wise ass guy gloating to the camera saying that he was 56 so we was in the money. He didn't have to worry about vouchers or dealing with private insurance companies. pull back to a wider shot with his 30 year old son holding his 7 year old grandson just looking at him in dismay.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 09:41 AM

121. That is easy: the moment I stopped watching it.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 10:01 AM

122. I was surprised to hear Romney throw his sons under the bus

when he called them liars. I figure the apples must not fall too far from the tree. It certainly seems that way after Romney lied and denied all night.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 10:07 AM

123. The thing that's getting the most attention is the Big Bird comment

and that's a negative for Romney. I think Romney did better in the debate, because it was basically unmoderated and he handled the lack of moderation better, and because he felt completely comfortable giving up entirely on being true and factual. But the thing that will be talked about the longest will be that he hates Big Bird.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 10:14 AM

124. You'd best get your ducks in a row for election night, bro!



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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 10:57 AM

126. Romney saying insurance companies will compete for senior healthcare vouchers/dollars...

the implications of that are huge...

To me I instantly thought the only competition between insurance companies happens between CEOs at the country club golf course...

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:03 PM

130. The second "Myth" Romney told his first lie....

...and we'll see ALL of his lies exposed in the next round of pro-Obama ads. In fact, the first couple of very effective ads have already appeared.

The President laid out a trap and Myth jumped in with both lying feet. You really don't have to do much when your whacked-out, jacked-up opponent does all of your work for you.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:06 PM

131. IT will go down as the firing Big Bird debate and be remembered for nothing else

except maybe the poor questions and moderation...

If firing Big Bird is the take-away (advantage Obama)

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 01:16 PM

133. The defining moment came near the very beginning where Romney claimed he didn't have a 5 trillion

dollar tax cut. I was incredulous. The President did contradict him, but not forcefully enough and point out that he was talking about the 20% marginal cut on Romney's own website. That defined the debate, and basically let Romney get away with telling his BS stories. I am going to remember this episode for quite some time.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 03:45 PM

135. It wasn't a debate, so we should stop trying to score it like one

It was basically two parallel interviews with both candidates answering the same questions with pre-fabricated "sermonettes" on their positions.

It could have been held with each candidate at different times or in different rooms and we would have seen the same results.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 03:47 PM

136. You're right.

It was actually very boring.

The only thing that kept me watching was trying to count the lies Romney was telling.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 08:56 PM

141. When people remember this debate they'll remember Romney's lying and the dissing of Big Bird....

The rest will fade pretty quickly. I'm sorry the Prez missed this chance to put him away but it will all be okay in the end.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 09:04 PM

142. Thank You Skinner

GOTV GODEM

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Thu Oct 4, 2012, 11:53 PM

144. For me the defining moment was what Occupy Denver was doing in the streets around the debate.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 12:32 AM

145. In terms of the electorate, I agree. For me personally, the defining moment was when Romney denied

his own economic and tax plan.

I guarantee you all I will still be talking about that regularly for the rest of my life, just like I am still talking about Willie Horton and the 2000 election theft in Florida.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 12:40 AM

146. one good thing to come of it

maybe we'll see the end of the idiotic and obnoxious "it's in the bag" and "will Romney drop out?" posts.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 12:48 AM

147. "Let's Be Clear" Ha Ha! In my debate bingo but I didn't get to drink to it til now!!

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 02:55 PM

150. I can't name it precisely, BUT...

... it was when Rmoney figured out that he could get away with bullying the moderator and The Prez didn't make a point of calling him on it.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 02:56 PM

151. There was a debate? n/t

 

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Response to Skinner (Original post)


Response to Skinner (Original post)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 03:01 PM

153. I had no problems with DU. I think you are doing great. My most

 

memorable moment is when Mitten's brought up Big Bird. I'll always remember that. Second all his lies.

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Response to Skinner (Original post)

Fri Oct 5, 2012, 03:28 PM

156. Romney changed his entire stance on taxes...

The other side is trying to say deny that is what he did.

But he utterly changed the Romney stance on taxes.

And there is another...

He started running on Romneycare, something he has distanced himself through the primary and most of the election because his own base vomits on him when he admits he did it.

I have never seen anyone in a debate utterly change directions in a campaign this way.

To me, Romney tried a fake pivot to the center to get centrist and independent voters. But it was jarring to see.

He will say anything to get elected.

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