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Thu Sep 20, 2012, 03:58 AM

If Romney loses the Republican party will blow up

Last edited Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:05 AM - Edit history (3)

If Romney loses, the Big Money boys will have thrown away a golden opportunity to frag the tea-party by letting somebody like Gingrich have the nomination.

Instead, with Romney as the nominee a loss will drive the Republican Party even further right because even though Romney is running on the wing-nut set of positions nobody believes he's a "real" conservative. He was positioned as the moderate candidate in the primaries. He will always, to the base, be the moderate candidate. He's Nelson Rockefeller, not Goldwater. He's Ford, not Reagan.

So if he loses it will be a national repudiation of nut-right positions that is read by the nut-right (aka Republican Party base) as a repudiation of moderation. They will be emboldened, not chastened.

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Arrow 51 replies Author Time Post
Reply If Romney loses the Republican party will blow up (Original post)
cthulu2016 Sep 2012 OP
davidn3600 Sep 2012 #1
longship Sep 2012 #2
Nightjock Sep 2012 #11
longship Sep 2012 #17
Jamaal510 Sep 2012 #3
B Calm Sep 2012 #4
Astazia Sep 2012 #5
Warpy Sep 2012 #6
Bernardo de La Paz Sep 2012 #7
vlyons Sep 2012 #8
KharmaTrain Sep 2012 #9
NewJeffCT Sep 2012 #10
KurtNYC Sep 2012 #12
nadinbrzezinski Sep 2012 #33
pampango Sep 2012 #13
Bluenorthwest Sep 2012 #26
porphyrian Sep 2012 #14
Shankapotomus Sep 2012 #15
Arugula Latte Sep 2012 #37
Shankapotomus Sep 2012 #42
LynneSin Sep 2012 #16
reformist2 Sep 2012 #22
LynneSin Sep 2012 #27
nadinbrzezinski Sep 2012 #34
modem77 Sep 2012 #18
tavalon Sep 2012 #20
Panasonic Sep 2012 #23
Doctor_J Sep 2012 #25
nadinbrzezinski Sep 2012 #35
tavalon Sep 2012 #19
spanone Sep 2012 #21
Doctor_J Sep 2012 #24
Lex Sep 2012 #28
Doctor_J Sep 2012 #29
cthulu2016 Sep 2012 #30
Arugula Latte Sep 2012 #38
Doctor_J Sep 2012 #50
truebluegreen Sep 2012 #32
Doctor_J Sep 2012 #41
Lex Sep 2012 #39
Doctor_J Sep 2012 #40
hifiguy Sep 2012 #31
Arugula Latte Sep 2012 #43
hifiguy Sep 2012 #44
JustABozoOnThisBus Sep 2012 #36
bluesbassman Sep 2012 #45
cr8tvlde Sep 2012 #47
Doctor_J Sep 2012 #48
cr8tvlde Sep 2012 #46
Doctor_J Sep 2012 #49
warrior1 Sep 2012 #51

Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 04:13 AM

1. Yep, They will think they have to go further to the right to win

It defies common sense too. I mean if you lose an election, it means you didnt have enough votes. So you respond by kicking people out of your party?

But that is exactly what they will do.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 04:18 AM

2. Could be.

I am hoping for Republican political decimation. Loss of the House -- it looks close, but we still have six weeks -- Senate still in Dem hands, Reid pulls the nuclear option on day one of Congress, and a unequivocal electoral mandate for the President -- over 350 EVs.

Not likely to happen without us all working our tails off. But I think it may be reachable. I see at least one route to 362 EVs if we get some breaks. I think there will be surprises in November, few of which will go Republicans' way.


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Response to longship (Reply #2)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:07 AM

11. is the "nuclear option" mean getting rid

of the fillibuster?.... which they should have done 2 years ago!!!
(seriously, I don't know)
I still don't understand why they didnt do it.

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Response to Nightjock (Reply #11)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:35 AM

17. Yes. That's it.

Understand that doing such a thing would be exceptionally politically disruptive. We have lived with the filibuster for decades and to get rid of it would likely disrupt the legended comity of the Senate.

However, one could argue that the comity is already all but gone. The Republicans have used the filibuster to politically obstruct a President and his party from governing. 360 cloture votes is unprecedented.

I sincerely hope that Harry Reid pulls the trigger in January and that they get the necessary 51 votes.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 04:46 AM

3. If the Reds keep moving to the right,

we might come to a point where we have a three-party system, where we have the Democrats, the so-called moderate Republicans who get purged out, and the looney tunes who control today's GOP.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 06:01 AM

4. The GOP is dying and

will be replaced by a third party. It won't happen overnight, but never the less it's happening!

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 06:03 AM

5. Our big tent party is big because it stretches in every direction...

Theirs on the other hand, stretches only further to the right. We include all shapes, sizes, creed, color, religion, & sexual orientation. My dad, a holocaust survivor, was a democrat. We used to do our sample ballots together when he was alive. When I was 18 (in 1974) he went over the issues with me. I asked him "what's the biggest difference between parties". He told me..."democrats vote to help everyone, republicans vote for themselves". Seems to me, not much has changed...neither have I.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 06:22 AM

6. Even if it's close enough to cheat him into office

(and since his mouth is stuffed full of feet, that's a big "if"), the way the party leadership rode roughshod over all the Paulbots and Santorum candidates has set the stage for a total bloodbath the next time the party tries to field a candidate.

You could see it in their faces at the convention. They stayed rooted to their seats, expressionless, and golf clapping. Gone was all the loopy cruelty of the purple heart bandaids and the Jim Crow "humor" directed at Obama. They were told in no uncertain terms that they were there as guests of the plutocracy and that their function was to sit and obey. Jokers who'd felt a flush of power for the first time in their lives at teabagger meetings did not react at all well to this and their anger will continue to fester.

The Reagan coalition of the rich with the utterly witless of the religious right is breaking down right in front of us. Mitt's lip service isn't fooling any of them. Only the Nixon coalition of the rich and the bigots is holding up, and that's because our candidate isn't 100% white with a WASP name.

I think Romney is going to lose, he's been a terrible candidate thus far and he's the type of "self made" entitled man that you and I know is not taking advice to heart.

The plutocrats will blame the religious nuts for needing to be pandered to, thus destroying his credibility as a moderate. The religious nuts will blame the plutocrats for offering a guy who has plenty of lip service but no convictions.

2016 is their watershed year. Even if they hold together as a national party that year and field a candidate, the bloodbath during the primary season will have left him severely damaged. They have an equal chance of not fielding a candidate for President, depending on how much resentment has built up. In that case, they'll go the way of the Federalist Party and the Whigs.

Good riddance.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #6)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 06:48 AM

7. The Ts call the Republican leadership the GOP-e or GOPe for "elite". nt

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 06:49 AM

8. they may be emboldened

but it's to run over the cliff, or rather to run the poor, elderly, non-white, and women over the cliff. I doubt seriously that the majority of American people will be so willing to go over a cliff.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 06:58 AM

9. The Knives Are Already Out...

Bishop Willard, just like Gramps McCain, won their nominations by default...the unhinged couldn't fall in love with one wingnut candidate or another. They all but canibalized their own in the primaries that left Shitt Onme as the only candidate standing and it's been a shotgun marriage ever since.

Mittens represents the party elite...the big money that has long ruled the party...exploiting the fundies, racists and other far right groups for their votes. That plan went awry with the teabagger "movement"...instead of astroturfing a new generation of wingnuts, they created crabgrass all around the party and have overgrown the elite...much to their chagrin. The Todd Akin mess is a textbook situation...the elite want him gone but the teabaggers have stood behind him.

Many are already jetisoning Willard as....as you say...not being "conservative" enough and already blame the "elite" for the ruin of the party...blowing an election they were sure could be won. Doesn't everyone hate the "colored fella"? The Bishop hasn't helped his case by running such an inept campaign. Thus this blame game will be simple...Willard will become the Michael Dukakis of the rushpublican party...quickly forgotten.

The real fun is what happens down ticket. If the rushpublicans fail to take the Senate and by some chance lose the House...the blood will really flow and we can sit back and enjoy a couple months of some major right wing angst and finger pointing. But to discount them is too soon...as they still will control key state governments and their crusades to shove ALEC type legislation on the state and local level will continue...

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:05 AM

10. They'll be inclined to believe they lost

because Romney wasn't pure enough - so, they'll likely nominate a true conservative next time out, somebody really far right. Marco Rubio maybe?

(of course, TDS has been calling it the Road to Jeb Bush for a while now, no?)

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:19 AM

12. I think the situation is right for the formation of a 3rd party

The GOP is very weak now because of this shotgun marriage to Romney. And I think you are absolutely correct about them regrouping more to the Right.

Imagine a 3rd party which peels away moderate conservatives and which drops the war on education, tax cuts for the rich / trickle down, and the war on women. The entire range of political discourse and options would shift Left and the GOP of 2016 would be even smaller and more isolated from the mainstream.

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Response to KurtNYC (Reply #12)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:31 AM

33. You are describing what happened in the 1850s

Back then the liberals in both the Whig and democratic party went on to form that third party we're discussing right at the momemt.

There is a reason I call them the modern Whig party, or know nothing's.

History does have echoes.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:24 AM

13. There will certainly be a huge intra-party fight, but I see Big Money beating the tea-party wing.

Big Money can see the demographic disaster heading the way of their party with the aging and diminishing numbers of white voters. Big Money cares, not surprisingly, about money - not abortion, the Fed, Agenda 21, wanting 'our country back' or most other hot-button teabagger issues.

As long as socially conservative voters provided the electoral numbers to empower Big Money the latter was fine with supporting the former's favorite hot-button issues in the interest of achieving the political power that helps them make money. If socially conservative (to be kind to teabaggers), if not racist, voters become an impediment to Big Money, if BM sees that a socially moderate or liberal party gives them a better shot at power, it will be 'see-you-later tea party' time.

Today's teabaggers will then drift back to the libertarian party or even more-whacked out parties of the far-right from whence they came.

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Response to pampango (Reply #13)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:29 AM

26. Well if you ask me, Big Money is late to the game on 'seeing the distater heading

the way of their Party'. I mean, this is the second cycle in which their Party played the same record, it failed last time and they just put in on again. No one will dance to it this time either. So the money might be far bigger than the brains if you ask me. I mean, look at Mitt and try to convince me that wealth equals intelligence and wise tactics.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:30 AM

14. They're losing because their rightward push is not supported by most people.

 

They may have the majority of the wealth, but they still need enough votes to succeed. If they do as you say, that's great, because they'll be out of the political scene for decades to come.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:30 AM

15. This is how bullies come to power

Off the failed weakness or perceived failed weakness of the previously tried leadership, whether in their own second fiddle leadership or in their political opponants' leadership.

They've tried the moderates. Now they will go with the bullies. Only when we've defeated their bullies will the republican party truly be finished. We'll have to redouble our efforts against them after this election if we are finally going to put a stake in them. They are going to be coming at us hard after they lose this one and we will have to get even tougher and smarter.

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Response to Shankapotomus (Reply #15)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:47 AM

37. They've had bullies at the top for a long time -- Boehner, McConnell, Priebus, etc.

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Response to Arugula Latte (Reply #37)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 03:19 PM

42. Agreed but I'm talking thug incarnations like Hitler

The ones for who civilized discourse is irrelevant and who truly believe might is right and go about behaving that way.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:33 AM

16. Romney won't cause it - it'll be the lost of the House that will cause it

I have a feeling that a slew of those crazy-ass Tea Party idiots that got elected to the house will go down in flames this election. None of them did anything of significance these past 2 years other than life the high-life off of their government paychecks. I think there is alot of buyers remorse with those candidates.

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Response to LynneSin (Reply #16)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:45 AM

22. You think they'll lose the House??


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Response to reformist2 (Reply #22)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:54 AM

27. 25 seats is very doable for the Democrats

And there are many freshman tea party republicans where the voters are having serious buyers remorse.

I think it will happen.

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Response to LynneSin (Reply #16)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:33 AM

34. The house has been in play since February at least

Got that from the horse's mouth. (Leader Pelosi). We even ran a story on that in the paper.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:41 AM

18. I know several republicans that are wanting to move to Canada or Mexico if Obama gets reelected.

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Response to modem77 (Reply #18)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:43 AM

20. And they'll have less chance than those of us who wanted to emigrate

after Dubya stole two elections. It isn't easy to emigrate to Canada and they are dealing with conservation shitheads up there too.

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Response to modem77 (Reply #18)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:46 AM

23. Tell them to get moving.

 

Those immigration requests takes forever, and they don't take political asylums from the United States - they'll look at you like you're fucking nuts and refuse admission to their countries.

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Response to modem77 (Reply #18)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:15 AM

25. Hah. Canada has socialized medicine, abortion with no time limits,

high taxes, public transportation and schools, and so on. They'll feel right at home there.

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Response to modem77 (Reply #18)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:34 AM

35. They do know of course that both have a form of socialized medicine

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:42 AM

19. "If" went out the window on Monday

The word for this week is "when".

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:43 AM

21. WHEN Romney loses the Republican party will blow up

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:12 AM

24. You're nuts

they will triple down on obstruction, lies, hate, fear, and propaganda. they have managed to turn what was once the world's beacon of freedom into a fascist 3rd-world hell hole in only 25 years by intimidation and hate. They aren't going to back off because of one loss.

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Response to Doctor_J (Reply #24)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:57 AM

28. The demographics are working against them big-time, with every passing month.

It's arithmetic. To paraphrase Lindsey Graham, they can't seem to get enough angry white guys to keep their party going forward.

But also, I don't think they'll change either.


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Response to Lex (Reply #28)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 10:54 AM

29. Yes, we've been hearing that for at least ten years

it's still BS. Look at Texas. Those "demographics" that are supposed to be helping us so much are firmly in place there. Yet it is deep red.

As long as there is Hate Radio and Fox "News", they will continue to move to the right, and continue to make gains

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Response to Doctor_J (Reply #29)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:06 AM

30. Did Nevada and New Mexico used to be red?

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Response to cthulu2016 (Reply #30)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:49 AM

38. Yep, and Colorado.

For so long it was unthinkable that those big Southwestern-Western states could be anything other than strongly Republican. I remember every presidential election when the polls closed the TV would immediately color them Republican (back in the day they often used blue for Republican states, before the 2000 election fixed red-for-Republican in place).

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Response to cthulu2016 (Reply #30)

Fri Sep 21, 2012, 10:22 AM

50. New Mexico went green long ago

which tends toward us. And they have a Repuke governor.

Next?

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Response to Doctor_J (Reply #29)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:21 AM

32. Yes, the "demographics" move more slowly than we would like but

Eppur se muove!

This is high tide for them, and the flow is already going the other way.

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Response to truebluegreen (Reply #32)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 02:48 PM

41. Nicely analogy, and completely off target

The demographics in TX have already moved, and the state is hopelessly Repuke. Same with AZ. Regardless of how quickly or slowly they're moving, in the places where they've already moved, the Repukes have a stronghold.

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Response to Doctor_J (Reply #29)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 12:05 PM

39. Texas is your example?

Hmmm.



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Response to Lex (Reply #39)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 02:43 PM

40. Why wouldn't it be?

This fantasy about the demographics turning for us is based largely on the growing percentage of Hispanic and other non-white races among the population. Texas has already seen that change in demographics - the highest % of Hispanics of any state. Yet they as far right as any state in the union. When someone posts, "The demographics are moving in our favor", that is simply not true. There are places in the country where the demographics have already moved, and one of those places is TX, and it has done absolutely nothing to make the state less Republican.

Please don't come back with another "Hmmmm...". If you have a reply to this, make it.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:17 AM

31. There will be a bloodbath of epic proportions

There are two basic segments of the institutional (what an appropriate word) Repig party: (1) the Plutocracy with their Randian Social Darwinists and (2) the inbred bigot/religulously insane - dominionist/bagger/caveman contingent. The plutocrats have the money but the lunatics have the numbers.

Originally this marriage of convenience was arranged by Ronnie Raygun, but the plutocrats have been getting greedier and the lunatics crazier every year. There isn't enough duct tape in the world to stick this mess back together again.

These two groups psychopaths are driving the Repig klown kar over the cliff, yet have in many ways nothing in common. The plutocracy's only real interest is in swindling every dollar out of the middle class after which the vampire squids will start turning on each other. The lunatics' only real interest is in returning to the Dark Ages. Oil and water, anyone?

Furthermore, demographics are turning, and brutally, against the Repigs. Within one or two more presidential election cycles it may well be basically impossible for them to manufacture an electoral college majority.

Let the circular firing squads commence now. The carnage will be a beautiful thing to see.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #31)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 03:27 PM

43. Damn, you can write!

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Response to Arugula Latte (Reply #43)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 03:43 PM

44. You might enjoy the third piece at this link.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:37 AM

36. This is just Republican comedy, tanking the election

They got nobody to beat Obama, so might as well goof around.

Watch 2016, when John Ellis Bush (JEB) makes a run at the White House.



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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #36)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 04:02 PM

45. Here's my take on JEB in '16...

Not enough distance from W yet. Obama of course will win in November, and if we retain the Senate and possibly take the House, President Obama will have a real shot at improving the economy and employment. This scenario will serve to highlight the failure of Bush the Lesser's term and JEB will spend 90% of his time answering questions about how his administration would be different from his brother's. He'll be on his heels from the beginning.

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Response to bluesbassman (Reply #45)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 04:28 PM

47. Just a thought...given it's Hilary, both campaigns/candidates have some "history"

We might actually see a campaign built on real politics, not mudslinging. Maybe? And I'm pretty sure Jeb has that already figured out. His wife is a superb campaigner...bilingual and experienced. Also, these are our two "royal" houses and the families acknowledge and like each other.

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Response to bluesbassman (Reply #45)

Fri Sep 21, 2012, 10:18 AM

48. I don't see this

if we retain the Senate and possibly take the House, President Obama will have a real shot at improving the economy and employment.


In 2009-2010 we had huge majorities in the House and Senate - bigger than we can hope for in 2013. So there will be again be a lot of appeasement and "reaching out" by the president. Not much will get done again.

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #36)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 04:19 PM

46. This ^^^ 2016 Jeb and Hilary

She gets four years of "rest" to consolidate her 4 international years, Obama gets his 4-years to finish his term. Columba Bush is pretty amazing...she is a real Latina...born in Mexico. I think it will be Jeb and Columba vs. Hillary and Bill.

Any ideas on VP? Marco Rubio? His wife is Colombian, too, which would make 3 out of four native Spanish speakers on the ticket, albeit a lot of Florida.

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Response to cr8tvlde (Reply #46)

Fri Sep 21, 2012, 10:20 AM

49. Heh

Columba Bush is pretty amazing..


She's also a smuggler. And Jeb's kids are all delinquents and reprobates.

BTW, despite your fondest hopes, they won't have two Floridians on the ticket.

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Response to cthulu2016 (Original post)

Fri Sep 21, 2012, 10:23 AM

51. they brought this on themselves.

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