Where did the idea of "unlikely pregnancy in a rape" come from?

[digonswine]

I never heard of it and it seems, suddenly, that it is being repeated.

I hope that it is an old piece of BS.

I suspect that it is a recent invention that has taken hold in the minds of fuckwits in order to make negligible the idea that the raped and pregnant need to have options regarding their rapist's baby.

I need to hold back the feelings of unreality at having to even say(type) those words.

[niyad]

1. from nazi death camp studies

Akin rape theory rooted in Nazi death camp experiments



The theory behind Rep. Todd Akin’s (R-MO) assertion earlier this week that women who are victims of “legitimate” rape would not get pregnant appears to be based on 1972 research that cites experiments done in Nazi concentration camps, a Missouri newspaper reported on Monday.
. . . .


In the article titled “The Indications for Induced Abortion: A Physician’s Perspective,” Dr. Fred Mecklenburg concluded that it “is extremely rare” for a rape to result in pregnancy.

. . . .

But it was Mecklenburg’s presumption that a traumatized rape victim “will not ovulate even if she is ‘scheduled’ to” that appeared to be the basis of Akin’s recent remarks.
. . . .

Nazis reportedly tested the theory “by selecting women who were about to ovulate and sending them to the gas chambers, only to bring them back after their realistic mock-killing, to see what the effect this had on their ovulatory patterns. An extremely high percentage of these women did not ovulate,” the article said.

. . . .

[digonswine]

5. The problem is-I have never heard this line of BS

It seems new. Not that it would matter.
Even if true-why would it have any bearing on who could get an abortion?
It just seems to be an easy way of dismissing certain realities.
This is why I am against the death penalty.
So what if ONE gets fucked over, as long as the public is served?
One is too many.

[obamanut2012]

8. It has been around for literally centuries

[digonswine]

16. Are they just using this misconception?

How have I never heard of this and others take as truth? What a bunch of ignorant fucks.

[Heather MC]

2. My guess old white men who took advantage of young girls

in their youth, but never impregnated them.

[Nine]

3. 'Legitimate rape' – a medieval medical concept

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/the-h-word/2012/aug/20/legitimate-rape-medieval-medical-concept

[NashvilleLefty]

15. Yep, that's what my own research turned up.

The earliest known mention was in 13th Century English lawbooks. It was believed that a woman couldn't conceive unless she orgasmed. Therefore, if a rape victim became pregnant, her rape allegations were thrown out and she was punished, instead.

Of course, the belief certainly predates that, but that was the oldest written mention of it that I could find.

[niyad]

4. google nazi rape pregnancy studies--but be prepared to be thoroughly sickened

[digonswine]

9. I will not-

But--is this crap widely believed? How can I have not heard?
The more I learn about my species, . . . .

[Egalitarian Thug]

6. The Nazi's human research conducted during WWII.

One of the many, many facts we like to ignore is that the people in control of our nation at this time were sympathetic to and supported the Nazis in the 20's - today. Almost all of our political discourse and strategy comes directly from Nazi discoveries. We sheltered and protected war criminals than, just as we do now.

Another inconvenient fact we choose to ignore.

[obamanut2012]

7. Originated in 13th-Century English law

For real.

So, the GOP's stance on this is, literally, positively medieval.

[digonswine]

12. Thank you-

each time I open my eyes, I discover a new level of horror.
Every time I think I know how low we can sink, I learn of a deeper and more terrible reality.

[Cerridwen]

18. The Guardian has a good article about it.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/the-h-word/2012/aug/20/legitimate-rape-medieval-medical-concept

The idea that rape victims cannot get pregnant has long roots. The legal position that pregnancy disproved a claim of rape appears to have been instituted in the UK sometime in the 13th century. One of the earliest British legal texts, Fleta, has a clause in the first book of the second volume stating that:

"If, however, the woman should have conceived at the time alleged in the appeal, it abates, for without a woman's consent she could not conceive."

This was a long-lived legal argument. Samuel Farr's Elements of Medical Jurisprudence contained the same idea as late as 1814:

"For without an excitation of lust, or the enjoyment of pleasure in the venereal act, no conception can probably take place. So that if an absolute rape were to be perpetrated, it is not likely she would become pregnant."

There's more about how women's reproductive organs are just an extension of the man's.

[obamanut2012]

20. Thanks -- looks interesting!

Will you post this in the Feminist Group?

[Cerridwen]

22. Please, be my guest. n/t

[Freddie]

10. Rick Santorum

Told of something similar a number of times and no one seems to have noticed. Probably because everything Ricky says is so ridiculous and/or offensive it was just another sentence.
(a treasure from FB I saved--photo of Rick w/caption "Every time Rick Santorum opens his mouth I have to check to make sure it's not really The Onion&quot

Anyway, I think the "pregnancy from rape is almost impossible" idea is an effort to simply dismiss the idea. "it hardly ever happens so we don't have to think about it"--they can cast abortion solely in terms of "baby killing" with no consideration of the woman involved if she's not seen as a person deserving sympathy.

[digonswine]

19. Even if pregnancy from rape was nearly impossible-

I do not get why we should automatically dismiss it. It makes no sense.
I would guess that murder by katana is uncommon as well-no need to worry our precious heads.

[Freddie]

21. In "pro-life" world

It's 100% zygote, 0% woman. Her needs simply are no concern as compared to the Holy Fetus. She is simply an incubator, that's all.
Introducing the rape issue forces people to consider the woman's point of view in the equation. Can't allow that.
Once had a FB "friend" ask "why is it so important to you libs that women be allowed to kill babies?" I never did reply to that one, with some people what's the point.

[nickolas007]

11. Hitler

i think its comes from nazi

[Downwinder]

13. From the Rapists.

Be they Nazi, Republican, or other.

[HooptieWagon]

14. Its the latest salvo in the christofacists war against abortion.

They want to ban abortion even in cases of rape, which obviously is an unpopular position. So they invent "science" saying women can't get pregnant when raped. Therefore, if they get pregnant it wasn't really rape.

[digonswine]

23. Right-a reason to dismiss it out of hand-

I am just surprised that I have heard this shit from not a few repugs lately, having not heard it before ever.
Also-what you said-IF it was rape, the kid would be chucked out-if not-NOT a legit rape. Like a witch test.

[HooptieWagon]

30. Exactly. If she floats, shes a witch...

If she drowns, shes not a witch.

[GreenPartyVoter]

17. It's very old. Here's a good link:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/125510393

[Hamlette]

24. Chris Hayes had a piece a couple of weeks ago saying it dates back to at least 2nd Century AD n/t

[Lucy Goosey]

25. It comes from pro-lifer cognitive dissonance

Pro lifers are anti-abortion, but by and large they are not sociopaths, so they can acknowledge, however subconsciously, that rape is bad, and that maybe having to bear a rapist's baby would be pretty horrible. But they can't get past 'abortion is bad', because most of them are black-and-white thinkers, so their brains have to find a work-around, and the 'no pregnancy from legit rape' thing covers their bases fairly well, with a bonus: a dose of good old fashioned slut-shaming misogyny. If she got pregnant, she secretly wanted to be raped, so having the baby is appropriate punishment.

See, it all ties up neatly, with no nuanced thinking required!

[digonswine]

26. I think you nailed it-

it's like a "get out jail" card for those who think the raped are not exceptions.
I mean, FORCING a young woman to carry a rapist's child is beyond the pale---but rationalizing that the female is complicit in conception-perfect.
It is a mental dodge. No need to rationalize one's beliefs! Whoo-a bullet avoided!

[PDJane]

27. Chris Hayes is correct. It dates from the time of the Romans.

Last edited Sat Sep 1, 2012, 12:08 AM - Edit history (1)

The fact that it gets recycled in 2012 is just amazing to me. Science has come a long, long way since then, as has medicine. However, the fact that this comes back as 'fact' just leaves me astounded ....and more than a bit afraid.

It's surreal, and I just don't understand how this kind of myth has taken such a hold on a certain kind of mind. It goes along with the extremely religiosity and the Christian nation thing and the absolute dependence on lies and illusion to build their world view.

If I had one book that I would recommend to everyone who wants to see or understand what is happening at the moment, it would be Empire of Illusion: the end of literacy and the triumph of spectacle by Chris Hedges.

[kestrel91316]

28. It is medieval in its origin, and was also claimed by the Nazis as a

result of "research" on prisoners in death camps.

So that ought to tell you all you need to know. Other than the fact that it is physiological nonsense.

[JI7]

29. This is all about hating women, viewing Women as less etc

this is nothing new. they are just being more open with their bigotry of women and others.

it's the same as blaming a rape victim because of what she was wearing. she must have wanted it because of the way she was dressed.

this is why these men feel they have a right to legislate the bodies of women while crying about wanting less government .

[Major Nikon]

31. The idea was most recently revived by this doctor

... back in the 70's. Ever since he's been quite the rock star of the fringe nut forced birther crowd.

Ohio doctor helps perpetuate rape pregnancy ideas
COLUMBUS, Ohio (AP) — The discredited notion that a woman's body can resist conception in a sexual assault has persisted in anti-abortion circles for decades, largely because of the efforts of a Cincinnati obstetrician who is considered a godfather of the movement.

Dr. John C. "Jack" Willke founded the National Right to Life Committee and wrote the influential 1971 "Handbook on Abortion," which has shaped the thinking of generations of anti-abortion activists.

http://news.yahoo.com/ohio-doctor-helps-perpetuate-rape-pregnancy-ideas-204010659.html

[Nine]

32. link doesn't work. try this one

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-501363_162-57500112/ohio-doctor-helps-perpetuate-rape-pregnancy-ideas/

[Major Nikon]

33. Seems to be working now

[Nine]

34. weird. it wasn't working earlier.

and I see the CBS version cuts off too soon unless I'm not seeing the "next page" button.

This part blows my mind

The book became an instant touchstone for the anti-abortion movement, selling 1.5 million copies at the height of the sexual revolution. The authors asserted that a douche, vaginal scraping and medications administered quickly after a rape "invariably" prevents pregnancy. "If the rape victim would report her assault properly, there would be, for all practical purposes, no pregnancies from rape," the couple wrote.

Medications? Are they advocating a morning-after pill? More importantly, even if these techniques worked, do they not realize that many rape victims do not report promptly or sometimes at all because of the psychological trauma? This is all very different from Akin's (and others') claims that the body itself "shuts down" the pregnancy.